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The every other day diet (Alternate day fasting)

A UK TV programme (Monday 6th August 2012) generated much interest about Calorie Restriction and Intermittent Fasting. The programme was a Horizon documentary, by Michael Mosley, called “Eat, Fast and Live Longer” (The comma is very important!)

I did a review of the programme, so you’ll be able to see what it was about by reading this – it will be long gone from iplayer. This free download will also explain the difference between Calorie Restriction (CR) and Intermittent Fasting (IF) and the three things that can vary within IF options.

The document also asks and answers – what has been proven by research into Intermittent Fasting? Has it been proven to make humans live longer? (No) Has it been proven to reduce the human risk of Alzheimer’s? (No) And so on.

Michael Mosley tried a number of options for the programme – a four day fast (if a cup-a-soup doesn’t count!); alternate day fasting and fasting two days a week. He simply found the latter option – two days a week – more bearable than the other options and thus “The Fast Diet” was born and 5:2 became a familiar term in UK dieting speak.

One of the people interviewed in the programme was Dr Krista Varady. She had been researching alternate day fasting for some time, which Mosley tried and rejected in favour of starving for fewer days each week.

In PR interviews for the book this week, two very interesting comments were made by Varady:

1) On BBC Breakfast, on January 14th 2014,  at approximately 1 min 40 secs in, Suzanna Reid mentions “the 5:2 diet” and asks Varady “You were involved in the research for that diet?” To which Varady replies: “There’s actually not any research on 5:2 itself, so all of the research quoted in that book is actually on every other day dieting. So when they talk about all the cholesterol lowering effects and weight loss effects, they’re actually reporting fasting every other day and not two days a week.”

2) On Woman’s Hour, on January 15th 2014, just after 23 mins in, Jane Garvey asks some brilliant questions. Here’s how the conversation goes:

Garvey: “You were part of that Horizon programme, all about fasting. So, outline what you believe, are the benefits of fasting.”

Varady: “It involves something called a feast day, where people can basically eat whatever they like, alternated with something we call a diet day, where people would eat about 500 calories, as either a lunch or a dinner. I’ve run about 10 years of studies involving 5-600 people, so we’ve looked at a lot of aspects … the heart protective and diabetes protective effects…”

Garvey: “Hang on – heart protective? diabetes protective? How and why?”

Varady: “After about four weeks or so this diet helps to lower cholesterol levels, triglyceride levels, blood pressure, blood sugar levels, insulin…”

Garvey: “How does it do that?”

Varady: “How does it do it? It’s basically the weight loss.”

Garvey: “OK, so that’s linked to weight loss, but not necessarily weight loss through fasting.”

Varady: “I really think all the benefits are through the weight loss. We have yet to tease apart the effect of fasting from the weight loss.”


And that’s all you need to know.

The front cover of the book claims “The only fasting diet proven by science.” But the person who has been researching this for 10 years still can’t “tease apart” the effect of fasting. Weight loss, by whatever method, is the factor that may deliver health benefits.

39 thoughts on “The every other day diet (Alternate day fasting)

  • I lost 40 kilos in just under 7 months using ADMF. Varady’s a genius. I bow to her in gratitude. Mosley, on the other hand, is a con man and rip off merchant who never gave Varady an ounce of credit whilst he made a mountain of cash off the back of her research. Shame on him and the BBC.

  • Well I would tweak my Intermitted fasting like that: On Mondays, Wednesdays and Fridays I do the fasting, start eating at 2 and stops at 6. I eat around 500 calories (salad, a piece of chicken…). While on the non-fasting days I eat a balanced diet of around 1,500 cals, but not eating whatever I want, I have breakfast, lunch and dinner, but stop at 6 as well. So my non-fasting days will be Tuesdays, Thursdays and Saturdays and sundays, since it is really hard to fast on weekends (kids, lunch here n there but try to keep it at half the portion you normally eat, it is not necessary to go wild on that, have some ice cream it is ok). and oh I forgot, on fasting days , you try to do some exercise on 2 days of the 3 fasting days, up to 25 minutes of hiit or any exercise. I believe that this method will yield the best result than eating whatever you want! like the traditional EOD….

  • Alternate-day fasting is a version of intermittent fasting, which is currently one of the world’s most popular weight loss trends.

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  • I am making my fast days 10 calories max. Just drinking freshly squeezed lemon juice in water.
    I find I get MORE ravenous when I eat a little than if I eat absolutely nothing.
    Half a chicken breast and a salad will make me feel way worse than zero food.
    One week so far and 3kg down.

    I actually enjoy fasting days because I don’t have to think about what to cook/take to work/buy.
    It’s wonderful getting up, grabbing a lemon and my water bottle and driving off to work.

  • I’m just wondering….I’m 20 stone, do I need to restrict to 500 calories on “Diet” days or Can I go upto a higher calorie intake and reduce as I lose weight ! Thanks

      • 500 calories is based on men needing to consume about 2500 calories a day for weight management. The calorie allotment is about 400 for women based on 2000 calories per day. That being said the diet should be tailored to the individual.

        To calculate the calories you’d eat on your fast day find out how many calories you would need to eat per day for your height and weight for weight MAINTENANCE, there are a number of websites that will calculate that for you. I’d try three and use the lowest number. Then calculate what 25% of that would be and that is your fast day limit. You can do 30-35% if absolutely necessary and it should work to, just not as fast as 25% does. And over time as you lose weight the calories needed to maintain your new weight drops and so then does calorie limit of fast days.

        Most people are to lazy to want to do all that work just to recalculate it every couple of weeks hence the average 400-500 calories.

        • Oh and make sure you’re having plenty of healthy fats and proteins on both days… just be careful because it’s really easy to go way over on your calories on fast days lol. But healthy fats will help you feel fuller and not have as many cravings, especially fats that are MUFAS, monounsaturated fatty acids i.e. avocado, nuts and seeds, oils, olives, and dark chocolate. Healthy proteins help keep you full and have been shown to reduce cravings, lean meats, dairy =milk, cheese, greek yogurt (much higher protein and less sugar than regular protein.), soy, beans you get the point.

          There is evidence that especially for women having enough calcium/dairy aids tremendously in weight loss.

          And have protein with breakfast! In conjunction with high fibre in the morning it has been proven to lower the overall amount of calories through out the day.

          I’m a nutritionist in Canada, I have hypothyroidism so it is very difficult for me to lose wight. I’ve had the most success with ADF and or carb cycling. Carb cycling also follows a higher cal day, lower cal day plan. There are a lot of different plans, I like Chris Powell’s plans. He has brief outlines of 4 plans on his website I got his book out of the library.

  • i have only just started my journey into EODD and have really started looking at videos and articles on it after already losing 30 kilos with fitness and lifestyle change I hit a plateau for a year and wanted to try something new as my nutrition has always been a challenge this lifestyle makes a lot of sense and in my opinion could save you lots of money grocery shopping for EODD is much easier on the family and you don’t feel bad on feast days you are rewarded for every fast day you put in by having a healthy feast with your family I I will be on my second fast tomorrow and am already noticing some changes to counter my fast day challenge I have a black coffee before hitting the gym. And a protein shake right after as I train in the afternoon or mornings it really depends but training an hour or so before I have the 500 cal meal that day seemed to work fine never felt like I was starving I drank heaps of water several litres keep this in mind as you really need plenty of water especially on the fast day o also took the garcinia Cambodia pills in the morning with coffee and vitamin pill this help d cut that starving. Feeling.. All in all I could do this for several months so I’m going to keep at it to break this plateau at 110 and get to 80 kilos my goal I started at 140 in 2013 but 2014 been stuck at current weight time for a change

    • Keep it going Dean!! Be proud of the weight you have already lost & don’t ever let the plateau stop you. You seem to have a good mindset & the exercise you do will benefit you mentally as well. Be proud & keep up the positive good work!!

    • Dean, how are you doing with fasting every other day? I’m hoping you were able to keep it up. Was thinking about doing this myself, but would like to hear from you first.

  • I’ve been on the ALTERNATE DAY DIET for a month now. There first week and a half wasn’t easy. I had headaches, was hungry and just felt off. I was expecting this because I tried a 15 day detox diet several years ago and had the same effect. Now a month in I have lost just over 5kgs. I use an app to work out how many calories I am consuming so it’s really easy to control my calorie input and output. I don’t obsess with keeping the calories to exactly 500 on down days. If I go over it’s not a drama. On my up days I do eat what I like but I try and keep my choices as healthy as possible. I love a couple of cookies with my morning coffee but I have switched to low-cal health cookies on my up days only. The rest of the day I eat whatever my family eats but I do keep an eye on portions so that even on my up days I still try and keep my calorie intake under the 2000 recommended.

    I love that I can go parties and family get togethers and I don’t have to say no to any foods. I just eat smaller amounts than I used to and I still have a glass or two of red wine (something I could never give up. At parties there are always several varieties of cakes. I used to have a piece of each. Now I just have a small piece of each which is great because I no longer over stuff myself but my small tastings kill any feelings of deprivation.

    Weight loss aside I have noticed I get less headaches, PMS symptoms are almost non-existent, I have more energy which has resulted in me becoming more active (which is increasing my calorie output), my back has stopped hurting and I sleep so much better. I will be going for a full medical check up soon but I already know the results will be infinitely better than my last check up.

    I have tried several diets over the years. My motivation is more health than appearance. I have tried pills, shakes, meal replacements, gym membership, etc and always give up within a week or two because the scales barely move resulting in killing my motivation. Any weight loss was so minimal that it just didn’t seem worth the effort. What’s worse I put on weight after every attempt. I love this program because in essence it isn’t a diet. I love cooking and I love food but cooking separate meals for myself and my family is tedious, time consuming and annoying. Depending on what I cook I can still have a substantial sized meal on my down days, plus fruit all of which has resulted in an improvement in my general health. I am doing alternate days for now but once I reach my goal weight I will continue with this program but only have 2 down days a week.

    Would I recommend this to everyone? Probably not. We are all different and any health issues must be taken into consideration. But if you have suffered the yo-yo diet effect in the past it’s definitely worth a try.

  • I have been on the ADF for a few months now and like the simplicity of the diet.
    I eat what I like one day, forget about food the next.
    Lost just over a stone, settling at about 10 stone.
    Difficult at first because you are moody, constipated and hungery and as the weather was still cold I put my glasses of water in the microway for 30 seconds and tepid water is then easy to drink.
    but whilst I like the diet I think it only works for me because I recently retired so if I am tired on my diet day it doesn’t matter.
    The ADF feels like a diet I can do long term but any diet that you can live with has to be good

  • Hi Zoe, thanks for your very informative nutrition blog.

    Have you had a chance to review this recent 2014 article from the Institute of Psychiatry, King’s College London,”Effects of Diet on Brain Plasticity in Animal and Human Studies: Mind the Gap”?

    It highlights the effects of diet on Calorie Restriction (CR) and Intermittent Fasting (IF) on Brain Plasticity. It also includes updated references to more recent studies on IF. Looks quite supportive of IF. What are your thoughts?



    • Hi Roger – many thanks for your kind words and for the link. Sadly there are too many interesting studies and too little time so I probably won’t get round to this one. Just about to look at yesterday’s aspirin article.
      Very best wishes – Zoe

  • The AFD diet works. No need to restrict what you eat on the feast days if want to go out. No worrying about calorie counting every day or trying to avoid ‘bad’ foods. Refreshing not having to worry about grabbing a pizza on the way home on a feast day.

    The other respondents are correct, you end up eating less on the feast days even if you were looking forward to really pigging out. And its got me more inclined to start eating better home cooked meals on the feast days as well.

  • im doing ADF but im water fasting on my fast days……..i dont get hungry at all especially knowing that tomorrow i can eat….

    i dont understand these people who “cant handle the hunger” PLEASE. you need hunger in order to lose weight…news flash, you’ll never find a diet where you wont ever be hungry…

    the reason why you put on weight to begin with is because you ate more calories than your body needed so your body stored it for later, for when you are starving and need it…

    STARVING. your body needs to starve it off OR work it off with excercise….

    im an all or nothing kind of girl water fasting works ADF works you just gotta be motivated and suck it up and do it.

    • Doing the water fasting diet, does it mean that only fat weight is lost and not muscle?

  • My partner and I started the ‘alternate day fasting’ diet straight after we saw Michael Mosely’s program which was thought provoking but raised more questions than it answered. A month later we both stopped because I didn’t think it was a long term solution. On my fast days I couldn’t bear the hunger and lacked the energy or will to do anything.

    In the past 20 months we have been on a fantastic and enlightening journey. We opted instead to eat a ‘low carb high fat’ diet and will continue for the rest of our lives. There was a transitional period of wondering ‘what can we eat?’ but finding Zoe and her recipe book made things easy. We are so grateful. We have lost weight and look better. My recent blood test revealed I had very low triglyceride and I have higher levels of cholesterol. I’m happy about that too!

    I would like to recommend to everyone the DVD ‘$tatin Nation – The Great Cholesterol Cover-up’. Go to for more information.

    Thank you Zoe

    • “We opted instead to eat a ‘low carb high fat’ diet and will continue for the rest of our lives.”

      Which may not be a long life if your plan is consuming all that fat, long-term. I thinks its a big mistake.

      • Actually, all the blood work, brain nutrition, etc points to better health. They have stopped seizures in some kids with epilepsy by doing a high fat diet. I don’t think it’s a coincidence that our low fat culture coincides with the upswing in Alzheimer’s.

  • I agree with several points made here in favour of this lifestyle.

    The biggest point I have to make is that the western world has gone crazy with ridiculously large portion sizes and we are bombarded with advertising every moment of the day encouraging us to eat unhealthy foods.

    Now the choice to still consume such unhealthy options or not when on this ‘diet’ is entirely up to the individual. Weight will still be lost if the 500 calories (or 25% of the calories needed to maintain the current weight) is adhered to on the diet days.

    The second best point of this way of life for me was the fact that I only had to count calories every other day and then I only had to count up to 500! I HATE the idea of looking at food that way and have never restricted my calorie intake in my life before. Life is too short to waste time working out how many calories I am eating every day!

    But the best point of all is that I am left completely free to decide WHAT to eat. I am very healthy with my choices and eat all organic produce and hardly ever consume refined sugars. I’ll make a starter when I eat at home over a dessert any day.

    I have been on this diet for a month now and have lost 13lb so far, have tons more energy and have such an increased level of fitness now being able to jive all night when I want to, when I couldn’t get through one dance just a few weeks ago.

    I have been working out for the past 3 weeks also and I have to say that the extra energy that this way of eating gave me went a long way in helping me to get started with an exercise regime. As a driving instructor I previously led a VERY sedentary lifestyle as I hadn’t worked out properly for years. Now I am addicted and loving every minute of it.

    I was suffering VERY high blood pressure and refused the drugs that my GP is trying so hard to get me to take for the rest of my life! Part of my 500 calories on diet day is a 250ml glass of organic beetroot juice (about 100 calories) and at least 3 cups of raw cocoa (2 tsp in a green or herbal tea with no milk or sweetener – a total of 45 calories). I think that those two foods, the exercise, the deep breathing/meditation I am doing every day and the weight loss as a result of it all are the things most responsible for helping to bring my BP closer to ‘normal’. Going to cancel my appointment this Wednesday and wait until it IS ‘normal’ before I go back to have it checked at the surgery where they told me that because my mother suffered high BP there is absolutely nothing I can do to bring it down! I also take 50 calories worth of fish oil and powered green lipped mussel supplements each day so that leaves me just 300 calories for my late lunch/early evening meal.

    On my ‘feast’ days I eat scrambled eggs for breakfast which I cook in coconut oil and sprinkle with turmeric, which I love.
    I have now cut out bread from my diet.
    And I will usually have a salad or veggie dish for lunch or a veg and fruit smoothie.

    If I want a glass or two of red wine later in the day I don’t worry about it and I may snack on some brie or stilton and have a real slap up meal two or three times a fortnight such as boeuf bourguignon with pommes dauphinoise but will more often enjoy something such as tuna steaks with a lovely green peppercorn sauce with rice and a green salad. It is all cooked by me at home and virtually all organically produced.

    I work out on the ‘diet’ days and I feel fine.
    I honestly think that if my body was going into starvation mode that I would notice that. I am on a diet day today and it is almost 2300 and I still haven’t had my beetroot juice and am not suffering in any way whatsoever. I have never felt dizzy or lethargic. I was just a little hungry in the first week.

    My partner is doing this also and he has lost more weight than I, but then he was more overweight than I was. What we have both found is that we just naturally eat less on our feast days at a meal than we did before.
    We cook smaller portions and our bodies tell us when we have had enough. Those signals were just not there before!

    We also take supplements because I believe that we do need them because we need far less calories than our ancestors have been discovered to have eaten. What they were eating was all fresh fruit, berries, meat and fish as and when available and today I believe we cannot get enough nutrients in our diets of less food which is not just farmed but often in soils that have been depleted of the minerals they would contain if better managed. And I think that it is VERY important to right the Omega 3/6 balance too.

    For losing weight this diet DOES work and it isn’t a diet that you will ever stop following either which tosses the yo-yo effect out of the window (I am SO glad that I have never dieted in my life before). Once at my target weight I will go on to consume 1000 calories on 3 days a week and continually monitor my weight and health.

    Is it dangerous in any way? I do not believe so.
    And it is certainly not as dangerous as just eating proteins or any of the other diets that get you to consume very odd combinations of foods that are not balanced in any way.

    Is it necessary?
    For me, it is the easiest way to eat healthily. The 48 hour eating pattern does seem to heal the body to the extent that you know when you have eaten enough and the counting is easy and only every other day.
    I never did heed them much but now I hardly even notice those that want to make money out of making me sick. I am happy, fit and even starting to sleep better, which has been a problem for me all my life. I honestly feel as though I have been set free.

    And THEN there are the findings that this way of eating reduces our cholesterol, and igf-1 levels and that the weight that we lose is almost all fat rather than muscle.

    Only been at it for a month but it would take some convincing to tell me that this is not the best thing the world has so far encountered when it comes to a healthy lifestyle!

    Thank you again, Krista
    I seem to be forever thanking this woman

    p.s. Partly through writing this I took a break to check out my BMI
    An NHS web site threw this at me:

    Before I started when I was 13st 4lbs and living a sedentary lifestyle:
    BMI = 28.2 – not far from being termed ‘obese’!
    Recommended calorie intake between 1515 and 1947

    Now at 12st 5lbs and following a moderate exercise regime:
    BMI = 26.3 – not far from being termed ‘normal’
    Recommended calorie intake between 1708 and 2197

    So now that I’ve lost a little weight but am still termed ‘overweight’ they are suggesting that I eat more!
    Think I’d rather listen to Krista’s findings and my own body!

  • Varady’s point is simple – it is about weight loss and I can speak from personal experience ADF/EODD is much easier to intergrate into my lifestyle and stick to than a regular diet. Last year I lost 24lbs on EODD and it’s still off and I’m down to fasting only 2 days a week to maintain.

    If you read Varady’s input to Eat, Fast and Live Longer, she says clearly the best thing about EODD is people stick to it because the sense of deprivation is minimal.

    In an ideal world people would eat a health balanced diet 7 days a week and no one would be overweight but we are facing a global obesity crisis.

    • Can I please have your email address. You seem to have found success on the ADF diet, I on the other had have been doomed to failure. I could really do with some advice from someone who knows what to do exactly on this diet. I would be eternally grateful for any tips, advice etc from you.

      Thanks in advance,

  • I’m really excited about EOD! It’s about savouring and positive eating. I know the mindset from years of being told the importance of regular meals (usually up-sized too) throughout the day etc (which is maybe not suitable or physiologically appropriate) a person may be unsure of EOD.

    I would never usually speak up about a diet- but this one has really changed my life! I was pathologically addicted to food and from years of over-eating and ignoring the true hunger signs this is the ONLY one that seemed to have a chance of success. It’s enjoyable, completely doable and healthy doing it!

    In two weeks I have lost over 7 kgs and feel full of life!

    Maybe people that talk about it should try it perhaps? (:

  • My EODD after 10 months:
    – Weight loss of 13kg
    – BMI 29 to 24
    – waist circumference 103cm to 90cm

    Minimal exercise and heaps of yummy food!

    In fact I hate exercise and love yummy food!

  • I agree with David and Mark – EODD works. I’ve lost 1st 10lbs over 2 months and I don’t binge on my feast days. I generally eat normally plus maybe a little more now and then, and the 500 cals on the fast days are easy to meet.
    I’ve switched to black coffee and mint tea and improved my diet of the feast days; less bread, more hoe cooked food and I’ve upped my exercise levels.
    So yes its working and only requires 1 day of willpower and I don’t have to avoid any food types.
    Dr Varady has got it right

  • I have been doing alternative eating days for little over two weeks and I can already see the benefits.. sure the first two fast days were hard but once you get over that it gets much easier.

    On the fast days I make sure that I drink lots of fluids. I normally have black coffee without sugar, 3 cups of green tea with lemon, water etc. I’ve now lost 8 pounds and on days when I eat,I try to eat healthy greens, proteins, good fats, high fibre foods etc. My portion size are also much more sensible so I don’t over eat and I feel full. Also I don’t restrict myself too much; on days when I feel like eating something sweet or a takeout I just eat it. I just make sure that it’s on my eating days. You have to be sensible, if you wanna stick to any diet for a long time. You have to think about food and our body in a realistic manner. We can’t completely get rid of your cravings so once in a while I have a cheat meal. My biggest problem was snacking. I would snack on salty and sweet food which made me put on more than a stone in just few months but now I have much more control over my eating habits. I feel that I have more energy.

    At first I wasn’t sure about this life style but I did a lot of research, looked at lots of youtube videos, websites, forms etc on people that tried this lifestyle or intermittent fast and I feel more secure about this lifestyle. Through my research I found that, for your body to reach the starvation mode you have to restrict your calories severely for long periods of time(little or no food for more than a week or two) which can have damaging effects to your body same with over eating. When we normally eat, we store calories that don’t get used up into fats for future in case our body does not get any fuel. If we don’t use the ‘reserve’ energy (fats) it just accumulates and over time it has negative effect. On fast days by not eating it just makes sure that the fats (reserve energy) gets used up. Also our bodies are built to keep our organs safe and organs are made from muscles so don’t worry too much about muscles wasting just make sure you exercise normally and move about. Your body will not start attacking our muscles just because we haven’t eaten for a day. The fats are first things that shifts.

    Well this my take on it.. I know that there are lots of ways to be healthy and to lose weight but I honestly feel that this lifestyle is for me. I think the most important thing to remember is that everybody is different so your body is going to react differently to different things. So do lots of research and find a healthy lifestyle that suits you.

  • I am now on my 3rd fast day after recently beginning the ADF diet. I have lost 6 pounds already, and already notice that on my feast days that I get fuller quicker, and have less desire to eat more.

    It is easy to follow knowing that it’s based on scientific research, and that settles any worries or misconceptions about whether it may or may not work. Dr Varady has proved through her work that it DOES work, yet is honest enough to admit that she doesn’t quite know EXACTLY why it works.

    Ignore the diet plagiarist Dr Mosley, and do something worthwhile to your body..time is ticking!

  • Ok, Varady does not knows the answer. Why? Because she is a scientist.

    By the other side, you may have ALL the answers. Why? you are a marketeer.

    Like atkins, dunkan, sisson, horton, “paleo-it guy”, “ketogenic-that lady”, “crossfit-bith freak”…. all of you, knows well about one answer: making money.

    Varady makes science. She lives in doubt. Its her job.

    PS: dropped 6% body-fat. Gained 4 kg of muscle. i can sprint like a cat. lift like hulk, and see my abs. Thanks Krista. EODD is simple, is effective.

  • Could you give me feedback on last night’s sugar versus fat on BBC 2.thanks in advance Annette

  • ” But the person who has been researching this for 10 years still can’t “tease apart” the effect of fasting.” – to be fair, she didn’t say she *couldn’t* merely that she *hasn’t*.

    She would need a eucaloric protocol to avoid weight loss, which may be a challenge to achieve if subjects don’t overeat massively on their feed days in an ADF diet. tried and failed.

  • Dr. Varady seems surprisingly [refreshingly?] prudent when addressing the question on how ADF might work: “How does it do it? It’s basically the weight loss.”

  • Hi Zoe,

    Happy New Year to you. I hope 2014 is better; the British media are sickening me to death. How can these sill women (sorry, no offense) health editors sleep at night?

    Have you seen this?

    Basically sounds like every other day diet, although I just skimmed over it.

    Kind regards,


  • I admit I’m confused. 500 calories a day is not a fast, it’s merely starvation level calories. And unrestricted eating half the time, followed by that, is not necessarily any calorie deficit when averaged per week.

    I don’t think research on actual fasting is appropriate to apply to something that does not involve any actual fasting.

    Let alone which involves binging just before the fast (a nice binge/purge mechanism there — there are many forms of purging, including starvation, exercise, etc.).

    I can see that a binge/purge approach to your weekend, along with ignoring it all week, would probably be very sellable in our culture though!

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